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Enermagy

By Fact-esque
creative commons/flickr/ by Sea Frost

I've seen a lot of good stuff written about McCain's dopey tire guage stunt but I haven't seen anyone point out how well it fits in with the learned helplessness theory of governance that conservatives have made their stock and trade. Empowering Americans to feel like they can rise to meet any challenge isn't a Republican long suit. But I lived through the last time Americans were inspired to do something about the energy crisis and not only were the steps we took effective, they were often fun.

In blogging time, Obama's move to cautiously embrace domestic drilling as part of a compromise is very old news but I want to point to a post by Scarecrow at FDL, in which he explains why he likes what Obama is doing:

More off-shore drilling is environmentally risky; as a supply or near-term price policy it's delusional, and if done alone only locks us into an untenable future. But conditioning it in the framework of strict environmental protection, rather than immediate price/supply relief, and as part of a transition to something else, is where the debate needed to be.

The Republicans are demanding to drill more, drill now, but no new drilling will happen for years because it takes time to do the permitting and there are no additional rigs available. But now Republicans and oil companies will have to pay for it with immediate support for alternatives they had been holding up.

He explains further in a down-thread comment:

The point is to reduce reliance on oil so that the pressure to drill more gets overtaken by its costs, relative to alternatives. To get there, we need the renewable tax credits renewed; we need to repeal incentives for oil companies to do other things and even tax them for doing so; we need to focus dollars on conservation/technology; and we need to recycle tax dollars from bad things back into the economy to relieve those most harmed. Obama’s plan has all these elements, but people think we’re talking about football cartoons because he’s said “I’ll give you more drilling permits, but only if we get all this other stuff.”

So that's hopeful anyway. I'm sure I'll be forgiven for hanging onto the cartoon football image until I see a compromise that isn't a giveaway. But, still, hopeful.

More energy talk: This Salon article from a while ago has a ton of tips to increase gas mileage. MIT says that we can start thinking of solar energy as "unlimited and soon." These guys want you to spread the word about the climate crisis.

Dean Baker calls the Drill Here! Drill Now! bluff:

So, let's give em what they want. They get to drill anywhere, with one small qualification. Since they insist that drilling will bring down the price of gas, we take them at their word. The deal is that we put a 100 percent windfall profit tax on gas prices in excess of $3 a gallon.

If they believe what they claim, they should jump at this deal. After all, drilling everywhere should get us back to $2 a gallon gas in no time. What do you say Senator McCain?

The Atlantic's James Fallows ends his watch of the air quality in and around Beijing and points to this informative video, Clearing the Air, from the Asia Society AND a cool Power Point slideshow that explains the situation in more detail. (only works with IE)

Comments

(174)

Never let the facts get in the way of good story

Dean Baker is an idiot

So, let's give em what they want. They get to drill anywhere, with one small qualification. Since they insist that drilling will bring down the price of gas, we take them at their word. The deal is that we put a 100 percent windfall profit tax on gas prices in excess of $3 a gallon.

If they believe what they claim, they should jump at this deal. After all, drilling everywhere should get us back to $2 a gallon gas in no time. What do you say Senator McCain?

This falsely assumes, that Exxon control the price of oil (it doesn't). Wall Street does. It falsely assumes that McCain ONLY supports drilling (he supports wide range energy policies including nuclear, solar, wind, battery technology etc).

This is called a "straw man" argument..it's loosely tied to McCain arguments, easily refutable, but not what McCain is calling for.

Drilling is PART OF the solution...It's not his magical fix all

By mrtoadAugust 8, 2008 - 10:30am

Then why arent they drilling

on the areas they already have leased? You dont know, do you? You are the idiot.

By hufflarry2000August 8, 2008 - 10:40am

Explore first!

Good question. I suspect because they know there isn't any oil there.

McCain is so like Bush. Bush went into Iraq because of a "slam dunk", they KNEW where the WMDs were. They were "there" in Iraq.

McCain runs on a platform of "let's drill for oil". It's like the Mickey and Judy show, "Let's put on a Broadway Show", only with Mickey and Judy, there was more substance.

Offshore is NOT a location. It's merely an idea. The idea is hardly original. McCain graduated 5th from the bottom from 899 Navel Academy Cadets, so for him, a good idea isn't hard to find, it's a miracle.

If drilling is so necessary, perhaps the Bakken, which stretches across North Dakota, Montana and southeastern Saskatchewan might be a good place to start "exploring". Notice, McCain never, not once has mentioned "exploration". Perhaps the work is just too big. EX PLOR A TION. Maybe that will help.

At one time, it was estimated that the Bakken only held 3 or 4 billion barrels of oil because that is all we could get to. Unlike the oil in say, Arabia, where the oil is in underground discrete pools, the oil in the Bakken saturates porous rock and shale making it difficult to get to. With new technologies, it's estimated that was might get from 350 billion to 500 billion barrels. You heard me. That is the latest estimate from the geological survey. 350 billion to 500 billion, which if true would be greater than all the reserves of the Middle East put together.

AND IT ISN'T EVEN OFFSHORE!!!!

Perhaps, we should put exploration BEFORE drilling, then we could have a reasonable debate. If there are any Republicans left who have any reason.

By deanrddAugust 8, 2008 - 12:23pm

So why is the g0p mantra

..."drill, drill, drill"?

And why aren't they drilling the leases they already hold?

Oh...and where are they going to get any more rigs so they CAN drill? All the rig-construction companies and jobs have been offshored -- excuse me, right-shored. You can't drill without rigs!

You've done an excellent job of backpedaling. But I expect nothing less from a RepubliCANT.

If all else fails, immortality can always be assured by spectacular error. ~~~John Kenneth Galbraith

By nonexistent manAugust 8, 2008 - 11:04am

Wow, MrToad, you actually

Wow, MrToad, you actually got something right! Exxon DOES NOT control the price of oil, the world market as a whole does. So drilling here domestically WON'T reduce the price of more than a couple pennies.

BUT is that what the GOP is trying to sell to the American public? No, they are telling us that "drill here, drill now" will get us off foreign oil and reduce prices. While in reality it will do neither. The amount of oil we could possibly get from ANWR and the OCS on an annual basis would represent a tiny, tiny percent of our total oil consumption. Not enough to even make a dent in the amount of oil we import or the price we pay for it.

But that doesn't make as quite a nice soundbite as "Drill here, drill now".

So given the environmental dangers, and the minuscule potential benefits, why would we want to drill the OCS and ANWR? Want a hint? Has to do with the oil companies balance sheets and their debt to asset ratios...

-- McCain = Four more years of the same --

By dtaylo75August 8, 2008 - 12:29pm

Respose to everyone all at once.

TO: dtaylo75August 8, 2008 - 1:29pm

Drill here, drill now..it not the policy...it part of the larger plan which is COMBINED WITH alternative energy solutions.

http://www.johnmccain.com/Informing/Issues/17671aa4-2fe8-4008-859f-0ef14...

Drilling here, supplying more of our own domestic oil HELPS prevent the US from getting screwed every time someone in Iran farts . The price of oil fell $20 in 3 weeks, simply because Americans drove less. But yeah, adding more oil won't affect the price at all.

TO: - By deanrddAugust 8, 2008 - 1:23pm
I am familiar with the bakken fields and their shale oil, they aren't really new. However, unless there have been some recent developments we currently don't have the technology to actually recover a significant amount of the oil. (not that we won't in the future...but we can't right now) If we can, I'm all for extracting that oil too....along with all the other things (nuclear, alt fuels, etc....)

By mrtoadAugust 8, 2008 - 1:21pm

By mrtoadAugust 8, 2008 - 2:21pm

LOL

The politicians are saying drill here, drill now to convince you right wing idiots to vote for them. They know the truth. The politicians thank you for your ignorance though.

By f u bush2August 8, 2008 - 3:23pm

Polititions need to get real

Actually, there are many new drilling and extraction technologies that are just now hitting the market. Look at Bakken articles dated after June of 2008.
Do a search on "New drilling technologies Bakken".

The real issue here that is simply not being discussed is that this is NOT a purely political issue. McCain and Obama are throwing around the words but stumble over the meaning.

Example: Drilling offshore. Question: Where offshore? Answer, "offshore".

How much oil the US has can only be solved by Engineers and Scientists. And ONLY if they do real exploration, and that includes offshore AND onshore.

A responsible energy policy would include exploration AND an accounting of what is actually and currently available. Neither candidate has looked at this in an adult manner.

The average American doesn't know how a vaccine works. Yet everyone has an opinion on the energy crisis?

By deanrddAugust 8, 2008 - 3:26pm

Drill the leases they already hold FIRST

No new leases until all the old ones are explored.

Oh, and where are they going to find RIGS? All the rigs currently existing in the US are also currently in use, and the only companies that build rigs are all offshore now!

More examples of the incredible nearsightedness of the Cowboy-hat Oathbreaker admuddlestration!

If all else fails, immortality can always be assured by spectacular error. ~~~John Kenneth Galbraith

By nonexistent manAugust 8, 2008 - 4:06pm

Well belss your heart toady!

You're obviously in that top 1% that just sits back and earns interest off their investments. Lucky you, No wonder you've got so much time to post here. I do hope that shilling for big oil adds to your considerable income (from which you of course only pay 15% in taxes).

By justintymeAugust 8, 2008 - 11:00am

Jon Voigt is a washed up,

Jon Voigt is a washed up, low-talent actor who hasn't had a good role in years because he looks puffy and old. He could probably get a job playing the homeless alcoholic on the corner in a police film. He is going to say he can't get work because he's been blacklisted. BS. Kelsey Grammer doesn't seem to have trouble finding work, and he's conservative and expresses his opinions publicly. But then, he's also talented and funny, unlike Voigt.

"Every gun that is made, every warship launched, every rocket fired signifies in the final sense, a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and are not clothed." Dwight Eisenhower

By MichtouAugust 8, 2008 - 11:34am

ISO the America hating, thought transcendentalist says:

I just did the Obama Birth Certificate search. For sure, it looks like it was rendered on a laser jet printer.

Being a non-thinking Comm-u-lib, I’m totally satisfied with its authenticity.

“Go BLObama”

By its_so_overAugust 8, 2008 - 12:29pm

And we will be totally

satisfied with spending your hard earned tax dollars to further our liberal agenda. We will have complete power so there is nothing you can do about it.

By hufflarry2000August 8, 2008 - 12:32pm

So where is your proof that

So where is your proof that most welfare recipients live in red states? Provide it, if you can't you will be admitting you were lying, just like you admitted you were lying about Franken's ratings. You already admitted you were lying about most aids patients in America being straight, you couldn't back it up so you admitted that you were lying.

By tropicaltoadAugust 8, 2008 - 1:38pm

It is all in the archive.

Where is the proof that WMDs are in Syria and fascism is on the left? That is NOT in the archive because no such proof exists because you were lying again. You and Shedd are getting the crap kicked out of you! This is what happens when you lie.

By hufflarry2000August 8, 2008 - 2:29pm

So you admit that you have

So you admit that you have no source to back up your claims and that you were lying all along. Thanks for clearing that up. It was big of you to admit that huffy.

By tropicaltoadAugust 8, 2008 - 2:39pm

Let's try this again

It is all in the archive. Your proof is NOT in the archive. No proof exists because you were lying. That is why your proof is not in the archive.

By hufflarry2000August 8, 2008 - 2:43pm

So you are admitting that

So you are admitting that you can not privide a source to back up any of your claims and that were lying. Anytime you would like to back up your claim as I did, you will stop admitting to lying about the stats, but you can't because you were making them up all along. It's big of you to finally come clean about lying.

By tropicaltoadAugust 8, 2008 - 3:28pm

By tropicaltoadAugust 8, 2008 - 4:28pm

frogg is lying about living in Hawaii.

But that is typical of right wingers. They think wealth and possessions are a measure of the person.

By f u bush2August 8, 2008 - 3:31pm

It's you guys that measure

It's you guys that measure people by their lack of wealth. Rich people are automatically evil and the poor are automatically saints according to you dumbasses.

And what does living in Hawaii have to do with wealth anyway? There are plenty of poor people here.

By tropicaltoadAugust 8, 2008 - 4:09pm

You sent porn to my son's computer

I now know who you are, where you work and where you live. It is not in Hawaii.

By hufflarry2000August 8, 2008 - 4:15pm

Here we go again. It's

Here we go again. It's called spam, dumbass, everybody's email gets it. You might as well try to blame me for losing your car keys. Just another huffy lie in an endless stream of huffy lies.

By tropicaltoadAugust 8, 2008 - 4:53pm

I do background checks for a living

You are totally dependent on the govt for everything in your life, you have been since you were a child. It is all you know. You pretend to be this tough, right wing, individualist when in reality you are a ward of the state, a socialist. You say you hate big govt and people who rely on the govt....and you have become everything that you say you despise. Your life must be a living hell.

By hufflarry2000August 8, 2008 - 5:07pm

Lol, we've been here before

Lol, we've been here before too. You claim you know all about me, yet you can't even come up with my name, I've heard all of this shit before. The "I do background checks for a living" is a new lie though, so you get a bonus for creativity. Poor, poor Larry Huff, he's the only guy to have ever gotten unwanted email solicitations in his email. Boo fucking hoo.

All that progress from you admitting to all your lies is lost. I had hope for you today Huffy.

By tropicaltoadAugust 8, 2008 - 5:14pm

Your life must be

a living hell. Pretending to be a capitalist right winger while living as a complete socialist.

By hufflarry2000August 8, 2008 - 5:20pm

By tropicaltoadAugust 8, 2008 - 5:09pm

It's you guys that measure people by their lack of wealth.

Sure it is frogg. Keep telling yourself that.

By f u bush2August 8, 2008 - 4:18pm

Froggy lives in Illinois...

And his name is Joe Carpenter.

You don't have to burn books to destroy a culture. Just get people to stop reading them.
---Ray Bradbury

By LiberalIconoclastAugust 8, 2008 - 4:37pm

im_such_a_loser

Nice distraction but ... once again, you've failed ... miserably.

Oh, and by the way - we know we'll never find your birth certificate. Your being shit on a rock and hatched doesn't warrant a birth certificate.

Oh, and I don't think your hermaphrodite mama will appreciate you saying we are to blow him. That's YOUR job.

"I'm completely in favor of the separation of Church and State. My idea is that these two institutions screw us up enough on their own, so both of them together is certain death."
George Carlin

By Pookie2112August 8, 2008 - 12:34pm

Do you REALLY think that the

Do you REALLY think that the FEDERAL GOVERNMENT hasn't verified the validity of his birth certificate?

Do you even know WHAT Communism is and how it has NOTHING to do with Liberalism? For fuck's sake, look 'em up on wikipedia!

Go BLOw yourself!

-- McCain = Four more years of the same --

By dtaylo75August 8, 2008 - 12:38pm

its_so_over' for McCain-- Birth Certificate search.

Hmmm, McCain was born in the Panama Canal...no doubt what the sailor s called his mom. Admiral daddy gave him his last name anyway. Barely a real U.S. citizen.
He does look a lot like Noriega.

By dewbie dubaiAugust 8, 2008 - 2:03pm

He was born IN the canal?

He was born IN the canal? Huh, I always thought he was born at a navy air station there.

Yeah, being born to a deployed military family really diminishes the whole "being a citizen" shit.

By tropicaltoadAugust 8, 2008 - 2:08pm

Aren't all babies born in the canal??

Well, frogs excluded, of course. Froggys are hatched ...

"I'm completely in favor of the separation of Church and State. My idea is that these two institutions screw us up enough on their own, so both of them together is certain death."
George Carlin

By Pookie2112August 8, 2008 - 2:47pm

Not in the Panama Canal as

Not in the Panama Canal as Dewbie said McCain was.

By tropicaltoadAugust 8, 2008 - 3:03pm

just keeps blowing over your head, turtle.

just like every other concept you have trouble keeping up with around here.

By dewbie dubaiAugust 8, 2008 - 3:19pm

Wow, Neanderfrog -

you've managed to go down the density scale farther than I gave you credit for. Congrats.

"I'm completely in favor of the separation of Church and State. My idea is that these two institutions screw us up enough on their own, so both of them together is certain death."
George Carlin

By Pookie2112August 8, 2008 - 3:28pm

In the birth canal , stupid.

With all the other non-com fishys....heheh..

Admiral grandaddy gets his son a command way down in Panama , to birth the grandson. Very fishy.

And what a safe command, with WW2 breaking out everywhere else,

Real fishy.

By dewbie dubaiAugust 8, 2008 - 2:56pm

You said he was born "in the

You said he was born "in the Panama Canal", not the birth canal, moron.

By tropicaltoadAugust 8, 2008 - 3:00pm

Well, that WOULD explain a few things...

If all else fails, immortality can always be assured by spectacular error. ~~~John Kenneth Galbraith

By nonexistent manAugust 8, 2008 - 4:04pm

Other than missing the

Other than missing the insult to McCain's mother (unwarranted, in my opinion), you're missing the obvious point being made here. Being born abroad does not disqualify one from being a citizen. If Obama is not a citizen because he was born in Hawaii (a US state when he was born), or anywhere else for that matter, than McCain isn't either. Both of them has US citizens as parents. Under US law, they are citizens.

"Every gun that is made, every warship launched, every rocket fired signifies in the final sense, a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and are not clothed." Dwight Eisenhower

By MichtouAugust 8, 2008 - 3:17pm

Two standard deviations below the mean

The state of Hawaii is now getting dozens of requests a day asking about Obama's birth certificate. They say it is REAL. The whole fake certificate was another attempt by the liars on the right to discredit Obama. Are you proud to be a person who repeats lies?

"When the birth certificate arrived from the Obama campaign it confirmed his name as the other documents already showed it. Still, we took an extra step: We e-mailed it to the Hawaii Department of Health, which maintains such records, to ask if it was real.

“It’s a valid Hawaii state birth certificate,” spokesman Janice Okubo told us."

"The Hawaii Department of Health receives about a dozen e-mail inquiries a day about Obama’s birth certificate, spokesman Okubo said.

“I guess the big issue that’s being raised is the lack of an embossed seal and a signature,” Okubo said, pointing out that in Hawaii, both those things are on the back of the document. “Because they scanned the front … you wouldn’t see those things.”

Okubo says she got a copy of her own birth certificate last year and it is identical to the Obama one we received.

And about the copy we e-mailed her for verification? “When we looked at that image you guys sent us, our registrar, he thought he could see pieces of the embossed image through it.”

Still, she acknowledges: “I don’t know that it’s possible for us to even say beyond a doubt what the image on the site represents.”"

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/article/2008/jun/27/obamas-birth...

"Every gun that is made, every warship launched, every rocket fired signifies in the final sense, a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and are not clothed." Dwight Eisenhower

By MichtouAugust 8, 2008 - 3:08pm

OMG POOK!!

ROTFLOL!!
And thanx I needed that

By justintymeAugust 8, 2008 - 12:40pm

I'm here all week - don't forget to tip the wait staff!

Glad I can be of service!! ;-)

"I'm completely in favor of the separation of Church and State. My idea is that these two institutions screw us up enough on their own, so both of them together is certain death."
George Carlin

By Pookie2112August 8, 2008 - 12:53pm

McCain's energy plan involves alien technology

By f u bush2August 8, 2008 - 12:57pm

AAAAAAAAHHHHHHH HHHHHHHHHHHHHHAAAAAAA!!!!

Since McSame's in TexASS, maybe he can find their Village Idiot!

"I'm completely in favor of the separation of Church and State. My idea is that these two institutions screw us up enough on their own, so both of them together is certain death."
George Carlin

By Pookie2112August 8, 2008 - 1:02pm

The Idiots in chiny

and watch the texas cracks. Real texans have been known open a can whoopass on occasion. Besides, you already know that the shrub is actually from kennebuckport (sp? aw, who really gives crap).

By justintymeAugust 8, 2008 - 1:53pm

Technically, Monkey Boy is a ... oh, the HORRORS ...

a ... YANKEE. Connecticut born and edumakated! If I'm not mistaken, his family hails from - picture me with a martini in one hand, my nose up in the air, conversing with Skippy and Buffy while sitting on the yacht lounging on Long Island Sound as I say this - GREENWICH, sniff - sniff.

TexASS can have him, we nutmegger's don't! ;-)

"I'm completely in favor of the separation of Church and State. My idea is that these two institutions screw us up enough on their own, so both of them together is certain death."
George Carlin

By Pookie2112August 8, 2008 - 1:59pm

Like empowering Americans is

Like empowering Americans is a DemocRAT strong suit?!?

Two words disprove that horse shit, affirmative action. The democRATS say to blacks, "You can not make it on your own merit, you NEED us to get a job, without us you are nothing." Now that's empowering!

And besides that, it's not like McCain ever said that inflating your tires wouldn't help, he just mocked Oblaha's assertion that inflating tires would help as much as more domestic production, which is laughable. Almost 70% of Americans already ensure that their tires are properly inflated, even if all of the remaining 30% were driving on low tires and finally did their civic duty as an American and inflated them, that wouldn't even come close to the savings Oblahma suggested.

Even if increasing domestic production doesn't drop the price at the pump a penny, it is UNDENIABLE that it would slow the flow of money out of this country into the middle east and would put more Americans to work. That much is unquestionable. I guess the democrats are more worried about Saudi jobs than American jobs, and that isn't very empowering.

By tropicaltoadAugust 8, 2008 - 1:53pm

Neanderfrog says ...

Like empowering Americans is a DemocRAT strong suit?!? ... "

I hear, "BLAH! Blah, blah, blah and blah. RIBBIT! Blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, MOMMY! Blah, blah, RIBBIT!"

"I guess the democrats are more worried about Saudi jobs than American jobs, and that isn't very empowering."

Oh, Neanderfrog - just ask your chimp-in-chief to check on this with his brother, BANDAR BUSH.

Quit while you're ahead, froggy. You're giving intelligent and legitimate frogs a VERY bad name.

"I'm completely in favor of the separation of Church and State. My idea is that these two institutions screw us up enough on their own, so both of them together is certain death."
George Carlin

By Pookie2112August 8, 2008 - 2:06pm

Increasing domestic

Increasing domestic production would slow the flow of money out of this country and would put Americans to work, and democrats oppose it.

By tropicaltoadAugust 8, 2008 - 2:11pm

Of course you have proof of that? No, you dont.

All the oil would go on the world market. It would have no effect for more than 15 years. There is not enough oil here to make a difference, there is no drilling equipment made in America, and the oil companies do not want to drill here.

By hufflarry2000August 8, 2008 - 2:26pm

Lol, prove increasing

Lol, prove increasing domestic production would put Americans to work?!? You are just fucking precious! Who the hell do you think would be manning those platforms and rigs? Nobody? Robots? No, Americans would.

BTW, lots of high paying jobs involved in building and running nuclear power plants, lots of cheap energy would come from those nuclear power plants too. Democrats oppose those jobs too.

By tropicaltoadAugust 8, 2008 - 2:31pm

Then why arent the oil companies drilling?

You dont know why. Dems do not oppose jobs as Clinton proved. Normal people oppose dangerous, environmentally unsafe nuke plants.

By hufflarry2000August 8, 2008 - 2:36pm

Coal fired plants are more

Coal fired plants are more dangerous than nuclear plants, and that's not even counting coal miners, and they pollute the environment with more invisible gas. So you were lying about being against co2 emissions too. You are on a roll today!

By tropicaltoadAugust 8, 2008 - 5:27pm

Bullshit.

Because most of what Big Oil already produces here ... goes over THERE. It certainly doesn't say here, froggy.

On the job end of it, why doesn't Big Oil start drilling on its already existing leases? That certainly would put more American's to work and the Democrats don't oppose that so you can tuck that talking point back in between your legs where your dick resides.

"I'm completely in favor of the separation of Church and State. My idea is that these two institutions screw us up enough on their own, so both of them together is certain death."
George Carlin

By Pookie2112August 8, 2008 - 2:26pm

What is produced here goes

What is produced here goes there?

Where is "over there"?

And so what if the oil from increased production didn't stay here? Why are you against decreasing the trade deficit?

By tropicaltoadAugust 8, 2008 - 2:35pm

Jesus, Mary, Joseph. You are dense.

Pay attention - THERE means it's not staying HERE. That would mean EVERYWHERE ELSE BUT HERE.

Why do we need to EXPORT if we need it HERE? Courtesy of your government ...
https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/print/us.htm...
Now, don't blame me that the stats are from '04 - call your government and complain.

US oil firms seek drilling access, but EXPORTS SOAR
http://nearing.newsvine.com/_news/2008/07/04/1639046-us-oil-firms-seek-d...

"And so what if the oil from increased production didn't stay here? Why are you against decreasing the trade deficit?"

You fucking moron, why WOULDN'T we keep what's produced here, HERE? I thought that's what all the whining was about ... whaaaaaaaaaaa! We don't produce enough oil here for ourselves so let's DRILL! DRILL! DRILL!

"I'm completely in favor of the separation of Church and State. My idea is that these two institutions screw us up enough on their own, so both of them together is certain death."
George Carlin

By Pookie2112August 8, 2008 - 2:58pm

If I had my say, what we

If I had my say, what we produce here would stay here, but exporting it does take a bite out of the trade deficit, and I guess you are against reducing the trade deficit.

By tropicaltoadAugust 8, 2008 - 3:07pm

McFly - is your skull that fucking thick? Never mind - it is.

It's you reich-wingers who are pissing all OVER yourselves to drill, drill, DRILL HERE, yet in the same breath you say, "export". If you've got such a fucking hard-on to drill, DO IT on EXISTING leases but KEEP IT HERE and stop fucking COMPLAINING.

Go back to the meds, Neanderfrog - your multiple personalities are rearing their ugly heads.

"I'm completely in favor of the separation of Church and State. My idea is that these two institutions screw us up enough on their own, so both of them together is certain death."
George Carlin

By Pookie2112August 8, 2008 - 3:32pm

Why do 95% of blacks

vote Democratic? Are they racist against themselves? You dumb fucking animal.

By hufflarry2000August 8, 2008 - 2:33pm

"95% of blacks vote

"95% of blacks vote democratic."

Another huffy lie, that is simply not true and you know it, but you don't care about the truth.

By tropicaltoadAugust 8, 2008 - 2:43pm

It is very true.

Even Al Gore won 92% of the black vote. Do you think that Obama would do even better?

By hufflarry2000August 8, 2008 - 2:46pm

You said "95% of blacks vote

You said "95% of blacks vote democratic." That is a lie.

I have a bet for you, unless you are chickenshit, if you can prove with ANY SOURCE (I don't care if it's media matters or kos) that even 85% of blacks vote democratic, I will leave for good. If I can prove that less than 85% of blacks vote democratic, you're gone. No new I'd's, no bullshit. You can use any presidential or congressional election, no local school board elections. I'll use the same.

Is it a bet, liar?

By tropicaltoadAugust 8, 2008 - 2:56pm

Here you are

www.renewamerica.us/columns/hutchison/041023

Now go away!

And I mean blacks who vote. You are not being smart.

By hufflarry2000August 8, 2008 - 3:08pm

Is it a bet?

Is it a bet?

By tropicaltoadAugust 8, 2008 - 3:09pm

I just proved you wrong

you imbecile.

By hufflarry2000August 8, 2008 - 3:11pm

You may have, but I'm not

You may have, but I'm not going to read all of that shit unless it's a bet. And no changing the bet, you said nothing of "blacks that vote".

By tropicaltoadAugust 8, 2008 - 3:15pm

I do not associate with right wing extremists,

I do not rent to them, and I do not do business with them.What are you, a 12 year old?

By hufflarry2000August 8, 2008 - 3:16pm

So you admit that you were

So you admit that you were lying when you said that 95% of blacks vote democratic, just like you admitted that you were lying about Franken's ratings and welfare. This is no surprise, everything you say is a lie, but I am a bit surprised to see you admit to it.

By tropicaltoadAugust 8, 2008 - 3:21pm

Rush is much better at

double speak than you. But still no proof of WMDs in Syria?

By hufflarry2000August 8, 2008 - 3:27pm

Double speak? What double

Double speak? What double speak? We made a bet, you tried to cahnge the bet after it was made, and now you refuse to live up to the terms of the original bet. Every single time you post here you are proving yourself to be a liar and you admit it.

You said that 95% of blacks vote democratic, clearly just another lie to add to your long list of lies. You are finally coming clean about them all though.

By tropicaltoadAugust 8, 2008 - 3:42pm

By tropicaltoadAugust 8, 2008 - 4:42pm

You are lying about living in Hawaii dumb ass.

By f u bush2August 8, 2008 - 3:50pm

I never made a bet with you

as you are an immoral liar. You are lying again now. 95% of blacks who vote choose the Dems. That is a fact. Now where is the proof that the WMDs are in Syria?

By hufflarry2000August 8, 2008 - 4:03pm

Lol, it's in the

Lol, it's in the archives!

It was very big of you to admit to all of your lies today, don't spoil your progress.

By tropicaltoadAugust 8, 2008 - 4:45pm

Republicans vote against their own self interest

95% of blacks vote Democratic because they understand it's in their own self interest to do so.

Many Republicans vote against their self interest. Supporting toads like Bush hasn't helped them, it's only hurt them.

By deanrddAugust 8, 2008 - 4:04pm

Dead mercenaries and right wing trolls

Do you know what they have in common?

Neither is capable of saying anything intelligent.

By f u bush2August 8, 2008 - 3:28pm

What's the difference between a dead mercenary and John McCain?

The shit in McCain's pants is fresh!

You don't have to burn books to destroy a culture. Just get people to stop reading them.
---Ray Bradbury

By LiberalIconoclastAugust 8, 2008 - 5:24pm

McCain wants to sacrifice your children to Iraq

By f u bush2August 8, 2008 - 3:30pm

WOOF! SCARY SHIT, MAN!!